This week, Chad and Cheese discuss various topics including the DNC, immersive technology, Chick-fil-A's elevated drive-through, Shawn Fain's speech on American workers, Alex Cooper's $100 million podcast deal, and upcoming events like RecFest and fantasy football.
They also touch on Chris Bakke leaving X Hiring after one year, as well as the decline of Indeed and its questionable strategies, as well as the launch of ZipRecruiter's new podcast. The conversation then shifts to the role of AI in coding and the potential impact on developers. Finally, they touch on the controversial law in Indiana that requires age verification for viewing pornography online.
PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION (Blame errors on AI)
Joel (00:29.762)
Just two guys who once got busy in a Burger King bathroom, but not with each other. Hi kids. You are listening to the chat and cheese podcast. I'm your cohost Joel non -compete cheeseman.
Chad (00:35.424)
Thanks and this is Chad, the fuckery continues.
Joel (00:44.908)
And on this episode, baby got backy, zip recruiter killed the radio star and Amazon says the quiet part out loud. Let's do this.
Joel (00:58.978)
What's up, Chad?
Chad (00:59.22)
I need some lil Jon right about now. Huh? Huh? Huh? How about that?
Joel (01:02.562)
Little John, the, the DNC. So you're, are you, you're, you're in bed when this thing is on live. Are you watching highlights? Are you recording it? All the above.
Chad (01:09.484)
Yeah.
Yeah, no, I mean, we can stream and they do replays and whatnot. So yeah, you get to see it in the morning. Plus, I mean, you can see all the, it's kind of like watching football, right? I mean, there are chunks that you want to see and then there are chunks that you don't. But yeah, so far seen Lil Jon, Oprah, Michelle Obama, Barack Obama, Wes Moore, Pete Buttigieg. And last night, last night, coach Tim Walz closed the show. My favorite part,
try not to tear up here, of the entire show. Not just last night, but the entire show was when Tim Walsh was giving his pep talk and his son Gus saw his dad on stage. He teared up, had tears in his eyes and was pointing at his dad and was looking out around everybody and was like, that's my dad. And that to me is everything. I mean, you see how Doug looks at Kamala, how Gwen looks at Tim, his wife.
Joel (01:52.29)
Mm
Chad (02:10.316)
or Tim's wife, and then how his kids react, right? It's been a very, very long time since we've been able to see real people like us, I guess you could say. Biden's 80. I mean, he's a grandpa, for goodness sakes. mean, we just, it's hard to relate to something like that. So you get to see real people and Donald Trump. mean, he's about as fucking plastic and all of his family is about as plastic as you can get. So, and I don't have an escalator in my house.
Joel (02:10.456)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (02:20.588)
Yeah.
Chad (02:36.096)
So you know, it's just, mean, you can see people that you can relate to and that's pretty cool.
Joel (02:41.57)
You said escalated.
Did you say you did tear up or you got a little choked?
Chad (02:47.742)
No, I do. I teared up. One of the things that gets me are kids and old people. Kids and old people, right? Those are people you don't fuck with. Those are people that you always care about. yeah, his kid, his kid literally teared up. did the Tim Walsh pumping his kind of like his chest thing, tapping his chest and was pointing at his dad. And he was like, he was just incredibly proud moment for a son and then obviously hope is.
his daughter and wife, Gwen. That was pretty amazing.
Joel (03:17.774)
Well, dear, dear listener, I've known Chad a long time. If something gets him sort of teared up, it's impactful. I gotta tell you, my
Chad (03:24.044)
And Julie said, I love this moment so much. I'm like, know it's amazing. Gus is awesome. She's like, no, I'm talking about you.
Joel (03:34.155)
You.
Get the camera out. yeah. my, my wife, you know, is a card carrying Canadian liberal. so I've been, I've been, privy to what's been going on. My favorite part, the role, the roll call is, fun. so when Indiana comes up, they rock some Michael Jackson, which may be controversial for some people. I was thinking Mellon camp or something like that might come on, but anyway, that Michael Jackson.
Chad (03:38.506)
I
Chad (03:44.46)
No, Forced. Yeah.
Chad (03:56.609)
Mm -hmm.
Chad (04:01.526)
Mm
Joel (04:01.678)
Mellon camps nice, but it's hard to dance to. And then they had Sean Astin actor who was Rudy, in the movie, Rudy, Notre Dame football. Everyone starts chanting Rudy. Like that was one of my, my favorite parts. The other thing is maybe I'm nostalgic for the nineties, as I think you are as well, but, in enjoy bill Clinton, why you can, because you even said like, I don't know how many more of these I got left in me. He's pretty shaky.
Chad (04:17.128)
Mm -hmm. of course. yeah.
Chad (04:22.442)
Yes.
Chad (04:26.283)
Yeah.
Joel (04:29.238)
So just enjoy bill if you like bill, for, for as long as you can. And James Carville, dude, I mean, I hated him in the nineties, but now I'm just like, this dude's hilarious and he's, he's, he's, he's old and grumpy and he just tells it like it is. I don't understand the Doritos thing when he just ate Doritos on the screen. Do you know what he was, what that was about? Yeah, I don't know. Yeah. He does create like.
Chad (04:45.484)
Mm
Chad (04:54.284)
I don't know. I didn't see it.
Joel (04:58.518)
You know, seeing Biden's poll numbers is like seeing your grandma naked. can't unsee it. You know, he says shit like that and it's just, it's just really funny, funny and awesome. so I went to the movies this week. took the kids to see the new alien, which is, which is horrible. Romulus sucks. I won't just for me, I won't ruin it. No spoilers, but it's, you have to leave your brain at the door. I like a movie that's a little more intelligent. So yeah, just the.
Chad (05:10.188)
Okay. Ooh, Romulus. Was it Romulus? Okay.
Chad (05:20.106)
Okay, please, yes.
Okay. Yeah.
Joel (05:27.298)
The special effects are better than, the Cameron movie from the eighties, but other than that, it's, it's a bad movie. Anyway, what stood out was in the, in the, moment before the movie where you see the commercials, it's usually like drink Pepsi or, you know, sign up for a, for mint mint mobile, whatever. There was a commercial for monster before the movie and a commercial for indeed. So I thought that was like really, really interesting. Apparently indeed has like a short film that they've produced.
Chad (05:46.805)
Jesus.
Chad (05:51.498)
Wow. Both ends.
Joel (05:57.42)
Maybe I'll look at that and comment it, comment out next week, but they are in the content creation business and promoting it during, during movies like aliens. So, so there you go. There you go.
Chad (06:06.358)
Wow, you should definitely send that to me. I wanna take a look at that. Let's go ahead and jump into shout outs. My first shout out is going to be the future of entertainment and kids, you're watching on the TikToks, I'm gonna go ahead and share my screen and we're gonna play this bad boy.
Joel (06:19.299)
Hmm.
Chad (06:28.458)
All right, Joel. So shout out to Immersive Tech without the goggles. For the listeners that are out there, Joel, what are you seeing here? What are you seeing here?
Joel (06:40.046)
Well, it's an immersive experience. I would say, it's pretty limited seating. I would imagine this in like a Vegas, hotel where you're sitting, enjoying luxurious food, hot, you know, hot dogs that aren't your typical hot dog. And you're immersed in the stadium of the sporting event. In this case, we're watching a European football and it looks like you're in the stadium and these people are cheering.
Chad (06:42.612)
Mm -hmm. Yes.
Chad (06:49.452)
Mm -hmm.
Chad (06:58.08)
Yeah.
Chad (07:04.01)
Yeah. Like they're in the stadium. Yes. Yes. Yes.
Joel (07:06.316)
with the people on the video, like they're part of the crowd. It's very sphere -like if you've been to the sphere in Vegas. I don't know if you know where this is or where I can get this experience, but it's very cool for sure.
Chad (07:20.688)
I believe it is in California. When we went to the Sphere in Vegas to see U2 and then we went to see Postcard from Earth, the movie that they have there, I said that this tech kills VR because you can have these amazing experiences with real people, not metaverse avatars.
And this is what I was talking about, right? The sphere is fucking huge. I mean, it's 1 ,800 people or something like that. I mean, it's huge. I can't remember the seating of it, but it is humongous. I think it was 18 ,000 maybe. I don't know. Anyway, it's big. This is much smaller. It's a fraction of that, but it's just as immersive. And you could see, obviously, sports here. This was in a Man U arena.
Joel (07:58.306)
Yep.
Chad (08:11.262)
And then also you could go to see you too. mean, all these different things, man, just so fucking cool. So shout out to immersive technology without the goggles, without the goggles.
Joel (08:11.48)
Yeah.
Joel (08:24.371)
The question is, they capture the misery of being a Cleveland Browns fan and being at a Cleveland Browns game like it is in person?
Chad (08:29.896)
yeah, I they can. I bet they can. I can listen to it on the radio and be just as miserable as if I'm there.
Joel (08:39.627)
Yeah. It's funny how, VR isn't happening like people thought it would, but this whole like go to, go to a thing, have really good food, comfortable seats and feel like you're there is happening. So in a roundabout way, guess VR is, happening. So my, my first shout out goes to, one of my faves Chick -fil -A. That's right. Chick -fil -A is launching its first elevated drive -through, drive, drive through.
Chad (08:47.776)
Yeah.
Chad (08:52.586)
Yeah? No?
Chad (09:02.806)
You
Joel (09:09.012)
It's launching in Georgia. What the hell is an elevated drive -through? You might ask Chad. Well, think of like a quick oil change place where you take multiple cars. In this case, the kitchen is on top. There's a little conveyor belt that delivers your chicken sandwich to your door. The new design will service two to three times more vehicles. One lane will be specifically dedicated to just mobile orders that you can pick up.
Chad (09:17.558)
Okay.
Joel (09:37.848)
There's no dining room. There's no playground. Just God's chicken as quickly in your pie hole as possible. Shout out to Chick -fil -A.
Chad (09:38.304)
Very nice.
Chad (09:46.251)
you
Chad (09:49.74)
And it's coming from above as well, right? So I mean it is.
Joel (09:52.116)
That's a chud. Yes. Yes. Chicken from above on a conveyor belt like Trump coming down on the escalator. God's chicken. That's right, baby. my God.
Chad (10:05.26)
You just ruined it. You just ruined it. okay. The next one. Next one comes as a shout out to Shawn Fain. We're finally getting leaders fighting for American workers. You got to check this out. Here we go.
Joel (10:07.084)
No.
Joel (10:17.006)
Mm -hmm.
Chad (10:34.934)
What?
Chad (10:46.462)
Naming names.
Chad (10:57.654)
Damn!
Joel (10:59.082)
And none of it's going to haircuts, that's for sure.
Joel (11:27.586)
Alrighty.
Chad (11:28.364)
Ouch. Ouch.
Joel (11:31.736)
So this was produced by the UAW. assume they're, like in the content game and, name and names on video. Jimmy Hoffa, somewhere is, is cheering in his grave. If Hoffa had had this technology, good God.
Chad (11:34.55)
yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Chad (11:46.124)
Jesus. Yeah, to me though, I mean, we've been talking about it on the show for a while. We've been calling out. mean, obviously we're a much smaller stage than, you know, Shawn Fain has. But at the end of the day, this is what's going on, kids. American workers haven't been getting paid for over 40 fucking years. And this is what's happening. CEOs are milking the profits.
Joel (11:51.48)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (12:07.48)
Mm -hmm.
Chad (12:10.87)
Profit margins are much larger and then we're bitching about inflation. It's not fucking a flay inflation. These assholes are they've got bigger profit margins. They're doing stock buybacks. And finally, finally, we've got Shawn Fain who is calling these guys out. And we do have also Joe Biden, Kamala, Tim Walz. I'm sure is going to get on board with this. We finally have leaders who are starting to say what the problem is. Shout out to Shawn Fain.
Joel (12:37.194)
Mm -hmm. So, so clearly on the DNC, you saw Fane, take the stage with the Trump is a scab t -shirt. That was, that's ballsy, man. I mean, if Trump gets in, that's, that's going to be fun. That's going to be fun. Well, my shout out goes to some big money in the podcasting world. That's right. Alex Cooper. No, she's not related to Alice Cooper, although she has the male name, I guess. And he has the.
Chad (12:45.19)
Yeah, yes.
Chad (12:54.273)
Yeah.
Chad (12:58.482)
Joel (13:06.478)
traditionally women's anyway, Alex Cooper is the host of a podcast called call her daddy. I don't know if you've heard it before, 4 million followers, 4 million followers. Listen to, listen to this podcast. It's sort of a, it's sort of a sports talk radio with, with women. You know, they talk about vaginas and how to satisfy women and I get, you know, like it's, it's, it's a fringe kind of out of the box podcast.
Chad (13:14.708)
At NOM, check it out.
Chad (13:20.192)
Nice!
Chad (13:34.292)
Okay. Yes.
Joel (13:34.39)
I didn't mean to say box as a joke, but anyway, so. Serious and I was surprised that serious is still in business, but serious, is paying them a hundred million dollars over three years, similar to the Joe Rogan deal. They'll have exclusive rights to sell the advertising on the show. And, it's just nice. I dream of our payday coming soon, although I don't think it's going to be to the tune of a hundred million dollars over, over three years, but a boy can dream.
And shout out to Alex Cooper.
Chad (14:07.289)
That's awesome. Well, you know what? Alex Cooper is probably, I don't know, she might be giving away free stuff like Chad and Cheese, like Chad and Cheese she might be. T -shirts from Erin App. We actually saw Krista from ATAP this week with the Chad Cheese t -shirt on. She says it's lovely. It feels good on the skin. Of course it does. That's from, of course, of course.
Joel (14:27.416)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (14:30.926)
Did you know she's Canadian, Chad? Did you know she's Canadian? Okay. In case you didn't know.
Chad (14:36.652)
She's incredibly nice to T -shirts from Aaron app. have beer. That's right. Craft beer delivered to your doorstep from Aspen Tech Labs. That's our kids over at Aspen Tech Labs. Whiskey from text kernel two bottles of whiskey from text kernel and or let's call them bullhorn. And if it is your birthday it's a little rum with plum. You got to go to Chad cheese dot com slash free to register. Yeah.
Joel (14:41.687)
Yep.
Joel (14:55.384)
Mm
yeah.
Chad (15:06.412)
I love the free stuff.
Joel (15:08.812)
That's right, Chad. Some listeners are celebrating another trip around the sun. Shout out to Sean Kelleher, Bradley Clark again, another Canadian.
Chad (15:18.785)
haha
Joel (15:20.056)
That's right. Andrea Wade, Nick Livingston, Trisha Lee Lanane, someone close to your heart, Aman Brar, Dina Funky Cold Medeiros, Joey Stubbs, Joe Stubblebine celebrates a birthday. And last but not least, Dr. Christine Picard Cheeseman celebrates a birthday this week. Happy birthday, everybody, to our loyal listeners.
Chad (15:34.902)
Mm
Chad (15:40.926)
Chad (15:46.1)
Nice. Excellent. Are we going to be able to see Dr. Picard down in Nashville, September 12th and 13th? That's a no. Okay. Sorry about that. We are going to be in the Shaker Recruitment Marketing Green Room at RecFest in Nashville. Two days, two days. We've got a lot of interviews going on, a lot of beer to drink, a lot of how to be barbecue, hopefully to eat as well. We're also going to...
Joel (16:01.388)
Hohoho, right.
Joel (16:12.234)
It's Nashville hot chicken. It's not barbecue. An honest mistake.
Chad (16:15.508)
You're gonna get the Nashville hot chicken. I'm gonna get the barbecue. We're also gonna be hosting a VIP event with great people, higher clicks and job pixel at the end of the day. One at Redneck Riviera. More info as it gets closer and on our LinkedIn. All you have to do is go to Chad's LinkedIn. Joel, if he has it and shared my post.
You can go ahead and click through and get yourself into the queue for a VIP registration. remember, you can't enjoy Wreckfest unless you're at Wreckfest. Go to ChadCheese .com slash events, click on the register and have at it kids. at it. Hope to see you there.
Joel (16:58.412)
That's right. That's right. And if you're headed to Tennessee, there's a team called the Titans that play football. And there are some members of the Titans that are in fantasy football. And if you love fantasy football, like Chad and cheese does, you got to get in the game to be registered to play fantasy football season number four, season number three, sponsored by our friends at factory fix draft day.
Chad (17:03.08)
yes.
Chad (17:16.949)
factory fix. wow.
Joel (17:25.822)
is September 4th. So there's still plenty of time to get your name in the hat, but you got to go to Chad cheese .com click the link, submit your name and you might win the greatest experience of your life. Who knows? Who knows? And Dina Pero is looking to repeat. She's talking a lot of shit online. so if you, if you don't, if you don't like the attitude, you got to play to put her back in her place. But yeah, it's, one of my favorite events of the year, fantasy football.
Chad (17:29.322)
Mm.
Chad (17:45.484)
I love it.
Yeah.
Joel (17:55.916)
with Chad and Chi sponsored by Factory Fit.
Chad (17:58.72)
Yeah, I'm going to be mad drafting because I'm going to be back in Indiana then. Yeah, September.
Joel (18:04.353)
will you be in person? Nice. You've, you've auto drafted for at least two years in a row, I think.
Chad (18:10.372)
yeah, no, I have. have. So, this year I won't have any fucking excuses.
Joel (18:15.65)
He's back, baby!
Joel (18:23.132)
boy, X is in the news again, Chad. Imagine that. Well, Chris Bocchi, former CEO of Lasky, Elon's first acquisition at X has left the building after just one year at X. In case you missed it, Lasky, the company, touted itself as quote, the most powerful platform to hire tech talent, end quote, and a farewell post.
Backe said ex -hiring quote has quietly amassed over 1 million active jobs from top employers and will be used by millions of people each month to find jobs in quote for context. Indeed claims 350 million unique monthly visitors compared to 1 million at X. Anyway, Chad, what are your thoughts on Backe backing it out of ex -hiring?
Chad (19:12.94)
Yeah, I think he got high on his own supply for too long. Let's go ahead and take a look at what's been happening at Twitter slash X. Okay. So Elon bought Twitter in October of 2022 for $44 billion in November of 2023. Fidelity and their valuation dropped it to 12 .5 billion from 44 to 12 .5. Why? Well, big name advisors as Walmart, IBM,
NBC Universal left the site over concerns about hate speech on the platform to which Musk responded during an interview by telling advertisers, well, go fuck yourself. Advertisers spent 744 million on Twitter during the first six months of 2024, about 24 % less than that of 2023, according to Media Radar. They were already spending less money in 2023 and now they're down 20.
23 23 or 24 percent just last week It has been reported that alone our loans that Elon Musk used to buy Twitter Have become the worst merger finance deal for banks since the financial crisis in 2008 and 2009 and now this Rats are leaving the ship canary in the coal mine. Whatever idiom you'd like to use thinking that Twitter
Joel (20:38.936)
Mm -hmm.
Chad (20:40.672)
will be a hiring superpower, let alone a fucking super app is just absurd at this point. mean, Linda Jacarino is recording videos that make her look like fucking Stockholm syndrome for fuck's sake. To me, this is the biggest ball of chaos. I can see why Chris left, okay? Again, this is not his first exit. He's obviously very talented. He's gotten companies like Indeed,
and also X to buy. Good for him, but man, this ship is sinking and the rats are jumping off.
Joel (21:12.451)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (21:22.254)
So yeah, buck Bucky is a startup and sell machine. you mentioned indeed bought his company interviewed, Zillow has bought one of his companies and then X, in his post, he mentioned like, I don't know what the hell I'm going to do now. My guess is his bank account says, yeah, he can do whatever the hell that he wants. right about now. I'm sure he signed, I'm sure he signed a year contract to stick around at Twitter.
Chad (21:45.772)
Just get me the fuck out of here.
Joel (21:50.958)
That was about a year ago. Shocker. the guys headed, headed on his way out. Now that he has some free time, maybe he can jump on the mic with us and, we can talk shop about what's really going on at X hiring and why we should care. X hiring launched about a year ago. I think it was November of 2023 and in about a year's time, they've basically managed to launch a job board that most of us can buy out of the box, for $29 a month.
Way to go guys. Way to go. look, where's the LinkedIn competitor we were promised, right? Where's, where's the one click apply that takes data from my, my Twitter account and, applies to jobs. still got to go through ATSs and multiple pages. Where's matching? X is supposed to know more about me than any job board, right? Kind of knows preferences where I like it. It sucks. They're the matching sucks. Where's, where's resume search.
Chad (22:21.438)
in two weeks.
Chad (22:35.628)
happen.
Joel (22:50.594)
I can't post a resume really. wait, I can, but I got to dig pretty deep into my edit profile to like put my work history. So they're not promoting it. Maybe it's a test thing. I don't know. Maybe the stuff is coming, but as far as I'm concerned, after a year of this thing, a lot of hype, a lot of Elon talking shit about, we're going to blow the lid off of LinkedIn. I see a whole lot of nothing. And I think back ease exit.
tells you what you need to know and that there's nothing going on because if there was something exciting, he might've stuck around to see it come to fruition. But I think he sees a dead end. think he sees not a whole lot of anything. There's not a whole lot of meatloaf
Chad (23:33.462)
You
Joel (23:35.968)
I got, I got nothing. lot of nothing burger.
Chad (23:38.016)
Yeah, as I think we've talked about watching Facebook, Google, all of these big names get into our space, they just don't understand the space. They have no fucking clue. I mean, Chris, he was able to sell Lasky again, which is a third rate fucking matching platform for God's sakes. Good for him. I mean, good for him. But I doubt he's going to come on Chad and cheese because if he says anything bad about Elon, I mean, he has Elon has way too many attorneys.
Joel (23:55.907)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (24:07.894)
Yeah, yeah. He hasn't sold enough of his companies to fight a legal battle against Elon. He's a fun Twitter follow though, by the way. If you're still on Twitter, know Chad, you've pretty much left it, but he is a pretty entertaining tweeter or exer, whatever we're calling it.
Chad (24:08.11)
Ha
Chad (24:12.18)
No. No.
Mm
Chad (24:19.456)
Yeah. Yeah.
Chad (24:25.388)
Twitter, excerpt.
Joel (24:28.984)
Well, you got some news out of Indeed, Chad. Let's do this.
Chad (24:29.162)
All right, let's jump in. Yeah, let's jump into the next one. So we've seen Indeed's traffic waning, revenues waning, new business models like CPA and CPSA waning and then imploding. Then we hear about Indeed Flex marching into temp staffing, then Indeed announces charging for API calls at three bucks a clip. And now, wait a minute, and now the following excerpt of an email comes from Eric.
Epling, strategic partnership manager at Indeed. And that was sent to us from a niche job board. Quote, Eric asks, would you, the job site, they're actually asking the job site, be open to a content for traffic exchange? This would mean that we, Indeed, may not be able to compensate you, but your job site would benefit from top tier jobs while we receive traffic from your platform. Also,
Please note that our strategy now focuses on, get ready kids, healthcare, tech, financing and accounting, and transportation jobs, end quote. What do you think about this, Joel? Sound a little fishy?
Joel (25:46.626)
So a little history lesson, kids, because I know that's what you come to the show for. Outside of SEO, Indeed's backfill model was really what ramped up the company to a different stratosphere. There was a time when pretty much any job board had Indeed backfill. There were very few that didn't. They were the only one that really offered it. You got paid on a click.
Chad (25:49.695)
You
Joel (26:09.614)
it gave you content where you didn't have content before. knew job boards that fired their whole sales and marketing staff because they could just supply jobs through indeed. a big, big problem with job boards is like, we need jobs. We need employers. Well, indeed came along and said, Hey, you don't need job. don't need postings. Like you can get them from us. And by the way, this was a really nice, Trojan horse where everyone that put backfill
Chad (26:29.228)
Yeah, supply.
Joel (26:34.466)
had a little link at the bottom that said jobs provided by indeed or whatever. And that jobs link, guess what was, was hot linked back to indeed .com. Well, Google loves backlinks. So basically indeed, I won't say tricked, but they leveraged all these backfill relationships to get better search rankings, which ultimately like tanked every job board that had had a enjoyed SEO rankings in the past.
Chad (26:39.222)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Chad (26:56.16)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (27:03.168)
It was very successful. I'm sure it was a pain to manage. There was probably click fraud. and fast forward to today, you have competition from the likes of Pando, Taoru, every programmatic solution out there. And they kind of ended it as far as we talked about it. but then they, then they launched these channels, healthcare tech, and it's basically like a way to, to call their co the call their customers. like, Hey,
Chad (27:17.868)
Mm
Joel (27:32.098)
Hey, hospital, regional hospital in Toledo, like we have a new healthcare channel. You need to spend more money with us because we have these great partnerships. And now they want you to partner without money as if, as if they have content that can't be gotten anywhere else. Like just cause we're in cause cause we're indeed, you should want to partner with us for no cost. I mean, they, they've lost the script. They don't know what they're doing.
Chad (27:50.164)
Exactly!
Chad (27:55.948)
top tier.
Joel (27:59.712)
It's more spaghetti at the wall. have a few hits, but mostly misses. None of this really makes sense to me. What are your thoughts?
Chad (28:02.144)
Yeah.
Chad (28:09.028)
Well, first off, mean, you the job site get top tier talent, aka send your job seeker directly to Indeed for no compensation. No compensation. And then they force the job seeker to register, meaning you just handed over traffic and a job seeker registration for fucking free. So if you're currently receiving compensation from Indeed, how long do you think it's going to last? That's the big question. Also,
Even if you are selling clicks to Indeed, they're paying you to siphon your job seekers and build their database, right? Back to the quote, only focusing on partnering with healthcare, tech, finance and accounting, and transportation jobs. Siphoning job seekers from niche job sites are the key. Now we've talked about this on the show for years. Job sites that are experts in specific spaces, they are much more valuable. In this case,
Indeed sees that they see your model. They understand your model and they want to siphon it dry. They want to drink your fucking milkshake kids. So at the end of the day, back in the day, monster crew builder, indeed the general job sites ruled the world now indeed sees that's not the case. Right. So all of those end of those organizations, those those niche job sites, companies understand that quality is better than quantity.
Joel (29:14.349)
Yeah.
Joel (29:25.518)
Mm
Chad (29:35.872)
the market has shifted, the landscape has shifted. And last but not least, if you are a job site and you need content, there are plenty of places to go to get great job content. And if you're not sure where, message me on LinkedIn. I will hook you up with some great contacts to be able to get you great top tier content so you don't have to play this bullshit game with Indeed.
Joel (29:37.528)
Mm
Joel (30:00.302)
Shadso wash will make sure you do not fall for the banana in the tailpipe. indeed. indeed. I'll tell you. All right. Let's take a quick break and rip into zip recruiter. What do you say?
Chad (30:05.285)
Ha!
Chad (30:10.11)
assholes.
Joel (30:16.992)
All right, Chad, our friends at ZipRecruiter, they've launched a new podcast called Talent All -Stars hosted by company president David Travers. The podcast aims to provide insights into effective HR storytelling and leadership in business. New episodes will be available every Tuesday. your calendars with both audio and video formats accessible on major podcast platforms like YouTube.
Chad (30:18.412)
Poof.
Joel (30:46.732)
We lost surgeon Shelley and gained zip recruiter. Not a fair trade. If you ask me, Chad, what are your thoughts on zip recruiter getting into podcasting?
Chad (30:56.396)
So at one point, Zippercouter was the biggest spender on podcasts in the world, kid. Zippercouter's stock is down. They aren't doing as well as they were in 2019. So instead of buying time on podcasts, well, why don't we start our own? I find this funny because back in 2019, when we were doing this thing for about two years, Zippercouter approached us and said that they would like to sponsor this show, the Friday show.
Joel (31:02.497)
Yep.
Chad (31:25.196)
but it would have to be exclusive. Now the idea was smart, but there was no way in hell that we were going to tell our loyal sponsors to take a fucking hike. That's not happening. But the idea, don't start from scratch. Align yourself with already established podcasts and known voices. That makes sense. We now have over 1300 audio episodes, 83 full episodes on YouTube. If you haven't subscribed, kids, go subscribe.
Joel (31:25.23)
Mm
Chad (31:54.444)
and over 300 total videos on YouTube, including shorts. Zippercouter is starting from ground zero and their president is the voice of the podcast. Really? If I'm a board member, I'm asking, why isn't Dave, the president of Zippercouter, focused on executing better go to market, better product, shaking hands and kissing babies? I mean, at least comb your fucking hair when you get on camera, Dave. Jesus.
Joel (32:08.237)
You
Chad (32:25.002)
What's it, at the end of the day, because we all know that, you know, obviously, Sergent Shelley lasted four years. That's a hell of a run. How long do you think this one's gonna last?
Joel (32:40.686)
I can't believe you did someone for their hair. That's good. That's irony. friend. quick side note, my son, Cole 17, his birthday's coming up. He's asked for one of these shavers of his head. Like he's gone from 80s death metal hair to like high and tight to bald. I don't know what's going on with my teenage son. Anyway, side note, sorry. I digress.
Chad (32:45.303)
dude, this is the best.
Chad (32:56.305)
huh.
Joel (33:07.36)
I'm with you, man. I mean, they spend enough on podcasts. They may as well just launch their own and hope for the best. let's go back in history again. like we did with indeed an SEO. there was a time when blogs were cool, man, everyone, if you were blogging, man, you were, you were on the cutting edge of cool. And after a few years, what happened? Company said, we need a blog. We need to like put out some shit, get some SEO, get some traffic. Turns out every company blog.
Chad (33:20.617)
yeah.
Chad (33:36.246)
Mm
Joel (33:37.71)
99 .9 % of every company blog sucked. was like this, this cleansed, vanilla, like hopefully Google will give us some love traffic and some still do it. mean, it still gets traffic, but if, you go there for entertainment and if you think there's going to be a ton of comments and engagement, like you're going to the wrong place. this is very similar to me.
Chad (33:51.424)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (34:08.206)
Can you hear me?
Joel (35:02.121)
And we're back, maybe.
Chad (35:02.624)
Alright, yeah you're there, yeah you're there.
Joel (35:07.613)
You there? Okay. It still said recording when I came back in. So let's hope that it's good. So I've restarted recording. So hope for the best. Let me get my script back in here. Sorry about all this.
Chad (35:13.75)
Hmm
Chad (35:25.214)
You're good to start back where the blogs suck.
Joel (35:29.513)
Yeah.
Joel (35:33.737)
script still there.
Joel (35:44.328)
Okay.
So should I start over from blog suck? Okay.
Chad (35:49.748)
No, just start from, they sucked, yeah.
Joel (35:55.187)
So this is going to, in my estimation, have a similar run. You're going to have companies say like, podcasts are huge. They're getting a hundred million dollars from Sirius and Spotify. Like we need to have a podcast on one hand. It's a little bit smart because it's a good idea. If you do launch a podcast to feature your customers or people that you want to be a customer. So when you look at the names that are in this podcast, you know, eBay and, some of the, my guess is they're all.
Chad (36:20.492)
Makes sense.
Joel (36:23.081)
They're all already a zip recruiter customer, so they're making them feel good. NBC universal Nike was on there as well. But the point like you're very right. Like this is a 20 minute sort of really vanilla interview. He's probably reading from a script. There's not a whole lot of sexy. There's no, there's no entertainment value sucks. I mean, these folks are giving really vanilla answers. PR is probably, approving every question that they're getting. They're probably every, I'm like, there's
Chad (36:43.982)
yeah.
Joel (36:52.115)
There's nothing exciting about this podcast. And, and as of Wednesday, when I wrote up notes for the show, they only had five ratings on Apple podcasts. I don't know what they have on Google and other places. I'm guessing it's not much different. I mean, they have over a thousand employees. You mean you couldn't send a group message to everybody and say, Hey, we have a new podcast. If you guys could go out there and like, give us a review. We'd really love it.
Chad (37:12.854)
Hahaha
Joel (37:21.843)
five ratings and none of them are even comments. It's just like click the star. No one's, no one's commenting at all on it. And this is a cut. This is a big company. This is a public company. And they put like, so that shows you how little interest there is in what they're doing. It's probably going to be six months to a year when they look at, no one's listening to this. We're out of customers to highlight. let's just like, let it, whether on the vine, just like blogs, company podcast are gonna suck and do suck.
and they should, they should, they shouldn't have done this and companies out there that look into this to do this, like don't, it's just a bad idea. It's just a bad idea.
Chad (38:01.258)
Yeah, and they're wasting their president's time. Number one, this just demonstrates that these motherfuckers don't do anything in the first place. Number one. Number two, if you are a company and you want to do something in podcasting or in video podcasting or something of that nature, go to where the people are already. Don't start from ground zero. That's fucking stupid. Go to where the people are. Do special projects with those those individuals that.
is how you actually do it. Then it's on the actual influencers or the podcasters or whomever it is to get the content pulled together. Right. It's what they do. It's not what you do. It's not what you do. You should be doing running a fucking company. Right. Anyway, enough ranting. Stop doing stupid shit. You spent a bunch of money on a on fucking podcasts over the years. You're not going to be able to create your
Joel (38:54.365)
Yeah, yeah. Get some people to do it for you. Get surgeon Shelley are retired, get them out of retirement, write them a check, payment loonies or maple syrup or whatever they want. And, they'll they'll do a hell of a lot better job than what you're doing.
Chad (39:01.11)
Yeah.
Chad (39:08.758)
than you easily.
Joel (39:14.631)
All right, Chad, let's go to Amazon. can't get any worse, right? Amazon said the quiet part out loud. Amazing. Imagine that their head of AWS told employees that most developers could stop coding as AI takes over in a leaked document obtained by business insider. An AWS spokesperson clarified saying the vision was about enhancing developers capabilities to focus on innovative work.
rather than signaling a reduction in their roles. Wink, wink. But the damage may have already been done. Chad, what are your thoughts on saying the quiet part out loud at AWS?
Chad (39:54.838)
Yeah, it's like second week in a row this has happened. Fucking Steve Schmidt at Google said stupid shit. And then it was like, I didn't mean that. yeah, that's it, Eric. I'm sorry. Yeah, Eric, you did mean it. Yes, you did. Now you're just trying to cover your tracks. Same thing here. But I've said it before and I'll say it again. The co -pilots that companies are equipping you with as helpers are replacements. Yes, you are training the AI. You are training your replacement now.
Joel (40:00.956)
Eric Schmidt.
Joel (40:16.691)
Mm -hmm.
Chad (40:23.85)
When it comes to recruiting, it's different. And here's why it's different. There's so much administrative bullshit that we've been doing for years that should be automated. Google just went off. That's my copilot. Fuck it. Anyway, there's so much administrative bullshit that we've been doing over the years that should be automated, like interview scheduling, knockout questions, and maybe the first interview.
Joel (40:38.205)
That's your copilot.
Chad (40:53.47)
if there's more than one in the process. But then there are parts of the job which are human, ones that include human interaction because for the most part, the people we hire will have to interact with humans. So we need to be able to assess interaction. Plus, doesn't the candidate deserve a human touch? Yes. Use tech to do the stupid stuff. Make your recruiters and candidates happier.
And last but not least, get rid of the fucking black hole. So when it comes to talent management, shit man, there are so many damn gaps that could be closed with tech, with internal mobility alone, which would also help upward mobility, retention, higher productivity, all leading to higher revenues. Plus, let's just say it, it's Amazon. Are we really surprised that they wanna get the humans out of their entire fucking organization?
Joel (41:48.809)
Well, they're out of humans to hire. So yes, they do have to have AI replace some of the stuff.
Chad (41:52.928)
Good point.
Joel (41:58.471)
When people are in a position of power and have enough money to not give a shit about what they say, sometimes the truth falls out. And when it does, you should listen. the discussions that are happening in the C suite of pretty much every major company or company that matters. This is what they're talking about. How do we eliminate more people? How do we reduce our head count? How do we reduce our overhead? Because that's what our shareholders want.
That's what most CEOs are compensated for in stock. So there's a huge incentive to have fewer people. And I think that downward pressure is real. If you are in a position that can be replaced by AI, augmented by AI, changed by AI in some way, you should be smart and think ahead. how can I
Chad (42:31.692)
Mm -hmm.
Joel (42:52.073)
take my current position or my skills and not be replaced by AI because this shit's coming. If it's not coming for everyone, if it takes a junior level developer and makes them into a senior level developer because it made them smarter, then you as the senior level developer are in trouble because you can't get any better. If they're paying them 50 % less, guess who's going to get that job or keep that job? You need to be really smart about this.
At the end of the day, they're going to be fewer customer service reps. They're going to be fewer burger flippers. They're going to be fewer marketing pros and content creators. And yes, the good recruiters and HR people will find a way to survive. They will adapt. They will survive the meteor crash and figure out a way to survive. But there's no way around it. They're going to be fewer jobs for these knowledge -based workers. And don't take my word for it.
This is the head of AWS. This is a major multi -billion dollar company saying this in a company meeting that was leaked to the press. This is real, not just knucklehead in his, in his home office. You need to pay attention to stuff because it's happening and these important people are saying it. There you go. There you go. Be alert people be alert because at end of the day.
Chad (43:53.023)
He said it.
Chad (44:09.728)
There you go.
Joel (44:18.449)
Unless you're smart about it, let's take a quick break and talk about being banned in the USA.
Chad (44:30.054)
Make this quick, I don't have a lot of time.
Joel (44:31.801)
All right. A federal appeals court has temporarily allowed Indiana's law requiring age verification for viewing pornography online to go into effect. This decision follows a stay on an injunction that had previously blocked the law, which is similar to one in, wait for it, Texas. The law requires users to provide ID for age verification, sparking privacy concerns from the adult entertainment industry.
Indiana's AG sees it as a win for family protection while the industry argues it's impractical, you think, and potentially insecure. Chad, what are your thoughts on being banned in the USA if you're a porn site?
Chad (45:11.574)
See, I was so excited about the political season. was happy and now this shit happens. It is political season. Indiana is a red state and Republicans love the freedom to take your freedoms. Health care, women's rights, books, now porn? What's next? What's fucking next? Come on, people.
Joel (45:34.133)
we won't touch age gating social media, but let's ban pornography. got it. Got it. So Indiana, is joining Arkansas. You can probably name the States. I'm going to say Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Montana, North Carolina, Utah, Virginia, and of course, Texas. This is mostly window dressing for voters who are saying like, get put porn. It's killing our kids. It's ruining everything. Let me tell you something, everybody. There's something called VPN, that.
Chad (45:46.304)
south.
Chad (46:02.699)
You
Joel (46:03.113)
that allows you to be in a different country if you wanna be when you access a website. And who understands VPN more than the kids, right? Kids more than anything, if you make a 10 -foot wall, they're gonna find an 11 -foot ladder, okay? So your kids are still gonna find porn unless you lock your own system down. But even then they got phones, they got, like they're gonna find it. Just like Chad and I had a way of finding Playboy magazines in Penthouse back in the day.
Chad (46:13.396)
Nobody. The kids.
Joel (46:32.297)
the dusty VCR tape, you know, and our, our naughty uncle's, attic. Like kids will find this shit because they understand, understand technology. Porn hub, employs around 1200 people, and they're about to get more people because now they need lobbyists to go to state governments, local governments, federal governments to start lobbying why they shouldn't, make porn illegal. And guess what?
Politicians are gonna have a hell of a time getting lobbied by Pornhub. Trust me, that's a party that everyone wants to go to, which brings us Chad, you guessed it, you guessed it, our dad joke of the day. Are you ready? What's the difference between Disney Plus and Pornhub? What's the difference between Disney Plus and Pornhub?
Chad (47:11.02)
It's a boongaboonga.
Chad (47:16.63)
Yes.
Chad (47:27.964)
Mickey and Minnie's relationship.
Joel (47:30.611)
Disney wants you to hate your stepmother.
Chad (47:34.688)
Yeah.
Joel (47:37.274)
We out!
Chad (47:38.358)
We out.
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