In this episode, Chad and Joel explore the multi-layered world of tech with a focus on Google’s recent “velvet hammer” message to employees. The Halloween-themed all-hands meeting at Google featured CEO Sundar Pichai in costume, discussing cost-saving measures, a slowdown in hiring.
But Google isn’t the only tech giant making waves. The duo also covers LinkedIn’s money-printing success with its latest revenue growth and new AI-powered hiring tools, exploring how these moves may shake up the job market and add pressure on competitors like Indeed. They touch on LinkedIn’s expansion into India and Brazil and its efforts to monetize the job-seeker experience, which may signal the platform’s future direction as it solidifies its foothold globally.
The episode also dives into broader tech trends, from the hybrid work debate to the latest study showing that hybrid schedules boost job satisfaction and retention. Chad and Joel discuss why some companies are still pushing to bring employees back on-site despite data showing the clear benefits of flexibility—and how these trends could affect the tech workforce’s morale and productivity.
To wrap up, they touch on the unique responses by U.S. expatriates and the wealthy looking to relocate post-election, highlighting immigration attorneys who report a surge in wealthy Americans exploring citizenship options abroad. With immigration as America’s “superpower,” they discuss the broader implications of these shifts on the workforce.
Whether it’s AI displacing tech roles, LinkedIn’s continuous growth, or the push for remote flexibility, this episode unpacks the layered changes shaping the tech industry.
PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION
Joel (00:31.49)
Ohhhhh yeah, two guys who would rather be at a dance party with Beyonce. Hey boys and girls, it's the Chad and Cheese podcast. I'm your cohost, Joel Grover, Cleveland Cheesman.
Chad (00:35.766)
Yes.
Chad (00:42.337)
And this is Chad Deja Vu, so watch.
Joel (00:45.346)
And on this episode, LinkedIn keeps printing money, Google takes ghosting to a whole new level. And wait a minute, let me check my notes. Was there an election? Was there an election recently? I don't, let's do this.
Chad (00:54.423)
Huh? What? Huh? Huh?
Chad (01:03.959)
Whew, man, that's deja vu all over again.
Joel (01:06.516)
It's the end of the world.
Chad, you look fine. Good God, Living your best life. Living your best.
Chad (01:13.197)
yeah, look at where I'm at, I'm in Nazaré, Portugal, which is, for anybody who's watched the Netflix series, that's where the 100-foot waves, the biggest waves in the world, literally, if you're on YouTube, you can see me pointing. They're right there, literally, right there. Yeah, it's pretty freaking amazing. So we're here in Nazaré for a few days, going to Cachecaix.
Joel (01:19.598)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (01:37.891)
for a few days and then hopping over to Spain, Cadiz and Gibraltar, which it's funny because Portugal is about the size of Indiana, right? So it's kind of like, you know, I'm visiting Louisville and Cincinnati, but, know, it's, it's, it's, it's Cadiz. It's
Joel (01:37.966)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (01:55.362)
Yeah, Kish Kish, Bloomington, you know, what's the difference? What's the difference? You are, you are a poster child for the expat movement for sure. You are living your best life.
Chad (02:05.584)
man, just great timing. That's all it is. It's just great timing.
Joel (02:09.218)
Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's rainy and gloomy here in, the Midwest. I'm sure you'll appreciate that being in the sunshine of, of Portugal. So, election talk, we're gonna, we're gonna be inundated with, the Monday morning quarterbacks, the autopsy reports. but what, what, what's your take? What was it like watching from Portugal? the European vibe. what, what's your thought? What are your,
Chad (02:19.307)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah?
Chad (02:37.153)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (02:38.316)
What's your take on the election and the results?
Chad (02:41.387)
I mean, the American people have spoken again. I mean, it is what it is. That's why we hold elections. But it's funny because I've received more messages this morning, probably because they're up earlier and I'm five hours ahead of you. But I received more messages from Europeans than I have from Americans. I don't know if that's because Americans are in the feudal position in the corner somewhere. I don't know what that's all about. But I have received
Joel (02:54.606)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (03:11.187)
many messages. about yourself?
Joel (03:12.362)
Is it, is it, are you okay? Is it, what are your thoughts? Are you super like, is it like for your mental health or is it just for like FYI, like information from an American about an American election when the Europeans contact you.
Chad (03:25.759)
Yeah, no, mean, at the end of the day, they were like, wow, you really saw that coming. I'm sure you're glad you have a place in Portugal. And it's like, I mean, yeah, I mean, that was going to be the transition no matter what, right? But you know, whether that hastens the transition or who knows, man, but you know, it's one of those things you luckily I have a wonderful wife who focuses on contingency planning. And so here we are.
Joel (03:32.016)
huh.
Joel (03:52.366)
You're so healthy. You're so healthy. Yeah. There's, there's a lot of meltdown going on here, in the U S as you can imagine my, my very, very liberal Canadian wife, isn't having her best day of the year for sure. that'll be an interesting thing to deal with. You know, was, I was reminded literally, 30 years ago, 1994, there was the Republican revolution. Do remember that the contract with America, Newt Gingrich and the Republicans taking over.
Chad (03:54.199)
haha
Chad (03:58.027)
I'm sure, I'm sure.
Chad (04:03.868)
Mm-hmm. I'm sure I'm sure yeah
Chad (04:18.224)
Mmm, yeah, Newt Gingrich, yeah. Mm-hmm.
Joel (04:21.038)
taking over Congress and everything. The world was going to end and change and this is a new morning in America. Well, guess what? Clinton stayed in for another term. The Republicans lost seats in the House and Senate. This is kind of what we do in America. If you don't like it, you got two years to try to make a change. But I remember sitting with my grandmother
who was, who was an icon in Bartholomew County, politics back in the sixties and seventies and me thinking like, wow, this is a really big deal. And her saying things really don't change a whole lot. Don't get too excited about what just happened. And as I age, she's kind of right. Like this, the ups and downs happen. I mean, as far as the autopsy on the election, I first thought of it as sort of tactical.
Chad (04:51.852)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (05:17.858)
the errors that she made. You know, I said when she first picked a walls that she might regret not picking Shapiro if she loses Pennsylvania. I was shocked to see, it looks like Michigan's going to go red, even though the labor unions, the Sean Faines, those initiatives. so, and also I thought that she could have made a better effort to gain or gain the, or engage with Nikki Haley voters. think there's 20 % of Republicans of which I probably put myself in that bucket.
of we don't really connect with the Trump MAGA stuff, we're like we're McCain, Cheney type Republicans. And I thought that there was an opportunity to win those people. And I felt like there wasn't much, like I received no direct mail about, Hey, if you're a Nikki Haley voter, consider, consider Kamala Harris. But I think it goes deeper than a tactical issue. Well, for money, they could ask for money.
Chad (05:53.675)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (05:59.819)
Dude, I know, I was one of those at one time. I was one of those at one time.
Chad (06:13.152)
Not in Indiana, yeah.
Joel (06:17.31)
our money spends just as good as anyone else's, but I like, I think it's just, it's just deeper than that. I said on last week's show with Emmy that this felt like angry men versus scared women and whoever was going to come out the most, the most was going to win. And clearly the angry men came out and I was surprised to see black men, Hispanic men come out in the numbers that they did. So I.
I think ultimately it's going to be good for the Democrats. know, look, it's, it's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease. You don't, can't get the clothes clean unless you have an agitator and like your favorite, you know, the best disinfectant is, is sunlight. think that this is a good opportunity for the Democrats to reboot. They have a good bench. They have good young talent. Like let's throw them in the game and, see, and see what happens. So I think ultimately it's going to be good for the Democrats.
But it's going to be painful if you're not a fan of Trump and Trumpism and the MAGA movement, because with the Senate swinging and the House and then SCOTUS, like Trump's going to get his way for the next two years. So buckle up and hope for the best, I guess. It'll be fun fodder for the podcast.
Chad (07:19.833)
yeah. Yeah? Yeah?
Chad (07:28.471)
Well, it's funny because to your comment, if you don't like it, well, CNBC, an article actually entitled, record numbers of wealthy Americans are making plans to leave the US after the election. Apparently, as Twisted Sister once said, we're not going to take it. And as immigration attorneys are seeing a growing number of wealthy Americans making plans to leave the country. Among the attorney cited in the article, David Lesbrance,
managing partner of Les Brands and Associates, an international tax and immigration firm, said the number of Americans hiring his firm for possible move overseas have roughly tripled over the last year. Now here in Portugal, they have pretty much done away with the golden visa or the, I guess you can call it, buy your way to citizenship program. But if you're looking to invest, you may want to take a look into the citizenship programs in another country in the
Caribbean Islands, which are a great place to check out. Demonica, the island of Demonica, if you invest only 200,000, you have an option to actually be a citizen. St. Lucia, you've heard of that one, 240,000. St. Kitts, 250,000. 235,000 for Grenada, 230,000 for Antigua. Or if you just want to spend a little bit more money and you want to try some other countries, Turkey, Malta, or
Austria are also on the list, they're just a little bit more expensive. you know, we'll see. We have options, especially the people with money definitely have options.
Joel (09:03.63)
You got it.
Joel (09:07.63)
People with money always have options. So shout outs, as I think you've already started, are sponsored by our friends at Kiora Text Recruiting Made Simple. And by the way, those guys are from Canada.
Chad (09:20.379)
Yes.
Chad (09:26.679)
They're probably more scared than we are.
Joel (09:27.134)
And I, and I get to hear for four years about how we're moving to Canada. So, Canada is going to have a special place in my heart and the Trump administration. but my first shout out goes to draft board, draft board, Chad, a, former firing squad, interview. if you haven't checked that out, go to Chad cheese.com search for it. and you'll find it. I think I gave them the guns. don't remember exactly, what you did, but, I got a email.
Chad (09:39.967)
Okay. I remember those guys.
Chad (09:53.259)
Double guns, I think.
Joel (09:54.73)
I think double guns is probably right. got an email from them, but they are pivoting, out of the business. What they did was if you remember H three jobster refer.com Zubka yet wire Z karma one LinkedIn referrals, et cetera, et cetera. The idea of like, Hey, I'm going to, I'm going to shotgun my network and they're going to apply to jobs. I'm going to get rich on people applying to jobs that I market, for companies. The idea, although a good one, and I said it in firing squad, it never.
Chad (10:05.366)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (10:24.168)
fucking works. Stop it. Stop the business of affiliate programs for sharing jobs and getting paid. Draftboard is just the latest loser in this game. Don't do it folks. Don't do it. We're here to give you public service announcements and save you a lot of time and money. They raised $4 million and it's all probably down the tubes unless this pivot works out and we know how pivots pivots usually work.
Chad (10:39.393)
Don't, don't, don't.
Chad (10:45.495)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (10:54.924)
Yeah, they don't. They don't really work that often.
Chad (10:57.377)
was actually January of this year. So I mean, it hasn't been a full year since we actually talked to Josh. And yeah, I mean, I think what we're seeing from startups over and over and over is that they have founders coming outside of the industry into this industry. They don't have the experience. They don't have the knowledge. They don't have the connections network. They don't have any of those things, but they do have the money, right? Silicon Valley money in many cases.
Joel (11:00.365)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (11:24.167)
And they think that is going to make them bulletproof. And unfortunately, that's just not the case, which is one of the reasons why if you are not from this industry, you need to find people, advisors who are in this industry to be able to help and guide you through that kind of stuff. So unfortunately they had a pivot. Good luck. Yeah, possibly.
Joel (11:34.296)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (11:41.71)
Some old guys with historical perspective is always nice. Some old guys that remember 2003 are nice to bring into the mix if you can.
Chad (11:52.107)
Possibly. I wasn't pitching us, but yeah, possibly. Next shout out, I'm going to share this one. You're going to love this, is to Bradley Clark and Stephen McGrath for Chad and Cheese Listener Made Art. Here's Bradley Clark's version, which Bradley created after listening to our Immigration Myth Busting podcast with Professor Zeke Hernandez. Bradley said the episode with Professor Zeke was,
Joel (12:13.688)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (12:19.507)
One of the best podcasts he's heard in a while. Aw shucks, Bradley. That's sweet. Now, he is now. Now I gotta go back and I've gotta find the other one, cause this is fricking hilarious. Then we have, then after I posted Bradley's great art skills on the socials, not to be outdone by a Canadian, our favorite Scott.
Joel (12:23.835)
he's Canadian though, so you got to take it with a grain of salt. The nice comments.
Joel (12:34.391)
You
Chad (12:45.321)
Steven McGrath posted the following Chad and Cheese art, which is a great segue as Steven has agreed. I think you know this, to get a Chad and Cheese tattoo in 2025. So we're gonna need a promotion around this event and we might use this art. We might use this art for his tat. This might be the tattoo. This might be the tattoo.
Joel (13:04.878)
Are you saying this is the tattoo?
Joel (13:11.0)
Ahahaha!
Joel (13:17.006)
and that crazy motherfucker would do it too. Holy shit. God.
Chad (13:20.701)
he would do it. He's already got the go ahead from Natasha. Natasha said he can do it. So if she said he can do it, he can do it.
Joel (13:27.896)
That's almost as good as free shit. Almost. Almost as good as free shit, Chad.
Chad (13:31.113)
It's it but it's not because if you do want free shit and obviously you want to have The cool shit the Chad and cheese send right to your doorstep t-shirts from Erin app the nice I mean they feel like butter on your skin. They feel like a hug from Chad and cheese t-shirts from Erin app bourbon barrel aged syrup for our friends over at Kiara beer craft beer craft beer from Aspen tech labs love those guys
Joel (13:58.318)
Yes.
Chad (14:00.639)
whiskey from two bottles by the way two bottles of whiskey from Tex Colonel aka bullhorn and if it is your birthday there's an opportunity when rum from plum if you go to Chad cheese.com slash free and register if you don't register you can't win
Joel (14:18.07)
You can't win. got to be in it to win it. All right. Celebrating another trip around the sun. It's a short list this week. Dale Gran, Graham Ferguson, Lewis Gleishner, Jarvis Carell, David Roddy, David George, Eric Clemens, Kayla Campbell, Bill Glenn, Steven Grover, and Chris Campbell celebrating a birthday this week. Thanks for listening and have a few on us.
Chad (14:30.871)
guys.
Chad (14:37.653)
Ooh, nice.
Joel (14:46.744)
Traveling other than Chad's Hopscotch is around Bouncing all around the place. I don't know if he'll be able to get any football at games while he's while he's in Portugal I think he's got a nice nice connection there that he's circumventing the the authorities so he'll probably Uh-huh I don't even know what that is. What's a Jodgy stick? What is it?
Chad (14:50.869)
bouncing all over the place.
Chad (15:01.481)
yeah. yeah.
Chad (15:05.953)
I do. Dave Ralph is hooking me up with a dodgy stick. a dodgy stick. Yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah, yeah. You know that anything that's dodgy in Europe is, you know, that's kind of dodgy. It's not quite right. yeah, it's not quite right. So you get a fire stick and then you jailbreak it and then you get like all the programs on it and...
Joel (15:21.582)
in Ireland for sure.
Chad (15:31.159)
Every single at least I don't want to say European, but I do know that just about every single Brit I know Has one of these dodgy sticks and and you know a good good Irishman Dave Ralph. Thank you, sir. We'll we'll get that dodgy stick taken care of soon
Joel (15:38.51)
Mm-hmm.
dodgy stick.
Joel (15:48.65)
so you do get to see football. So aside from seeing, Ohio States, fantastic went over number three ranked Penn state. you see your NFL game. let's get to our fantasy football leaderboard, fantasy football. course, you know, Chad is sponsored by our friends at factory fix. let's, let's, let's get to it in first place, second week in a row.
Chad (15:51.41)
Mm-hmm. Yes.
Chad (15:58.069)
Uh-huh.
Chad (16:08.407)
The Actory Fix.
Joel (16:16.064)
It's me motherfucker. It's me. Number one again. That's right. Followed by Dean, Dean, the daddy Mac mackerel, David Stiffle, Jennifer, Terry Tharp, Chad, so wash in the fifth spot. You're right there in the chunky middle, not getting too cocky, not falling behind. That's good. Followed by Keith Sonderling, Christie Lisbon, Laura Martinelli, Dina, Perot for Pyros, Axon Jackson, doll quest.
Chad (16:18.731)
Whoo! Rigged. It's rigged.
Chad (16:29.611)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Joel (16:42.474)
Adam Gordon, as much as he wants to be at the bottom, Sean Horton, here's a who just loves that last place spot. Boy, I'll tell you, geez, he loves that. loves it. All right. Can I make it three weeks in a row? You got to tune in next week to find out that is factory fix sponsored.
Chad (16:49.781)
He does. He enjoys it.
Chad (16:58.293)
I just looked at who you were playing. I think you can make it. Yeah, I think you can make it. Yeah. It should be an easy week. It should be an easy week. Yeah. I think it's bottom third. It's bottom third. I can't remember, but it's bottom third. Yeah. No. No.
Joel (17:03.63)
Who is it? I haven't even looked.
Who is it? No names. We're not mentioning names.
But we do mention names in the...
Chad (17:20.551)
Topics!
Joel (17:23.95)
All right, let's talk a little hybrid, shall we? A six month experiment with over 1600 employees recently showed that hybrid work had no negative impact on productivity, performance, or promotion rates. Instead, it significantly improved job satisfaction and reduced quit rates by a third, particularly benefiting non-managers, women, and employees with long commutes. Managers initially skeptical about hybrid work.
have revised their views. They're having some second thoughts, finding it actually increased productivity. Chad, Chad, they might've been listening to us. How do you feel about this news on hybrid work?
Chad (18:06.263)
Yeah, I think it just makes sense. I think it's a duh moment. I think it's a treat your employees like adults moment. And again, for more context, jump a little bit deeper into this. The study happened over six months, as you'd said, from August 2021 to January of 2022. The study participants were chosen randomly and divided into on-site work groups and a hybrid work group. They either went into the office every day or they went
in on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. So this is a hybrid where you were able to work twice two days from home. Now, quote, once one of the things that you said, no differences in productivity, performance review grade or promotion. So a hybrid schedule led to measurable improvements and higher jobs. Obviously, they were happier at the end of the day. And then a third higher retention rates. What don't you want to do? I don't want to interview more people.
I don't want to hire more people. don't want to replace the stud who literally just wants to work from home or she wants to work from home. I want them to be happy. then there was another article in Fortune that outlines a new study that reveals where jobs with work from home options have better stock returns. Again, productivity, retention, and happiness equals money.
Right? to me, again, this just seems like a no brainer. I don't know why companies keep fighting it, but we're still watching companies fight this. Why?
Joel (19:45.868)
All right, so let's do some auditing for a second. Hybrid work, productivity, up. Employee satisfaction, up. Fears in the C-suite, unfounded. Cost efficiency, up. Work-life balance, improved. Health and wellbeing, improved. Inclusivity, improved. So...
Chad (19:51.713)
Mm.
Chad (20:00.033)
You
Chad (20:09.867)
Yes.
Joel (20:12.046)
Remind me exactly why we're being forced back into the office. yeah. It's Elon's morality question. we're being immoral by not coming back into the office. look, the data's out. the excuses are getting fewer and farther between, the, the bottom line is if, if you're a company not embracing work from home, hybrid work, then, I don't know, Jean, Jean Walter might have.
Chad (20:18.908)
yeah.
Chad (20:30.369)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (20:41.424)
message for you.
Chad (20:48.075)
The thing for me was that some of the contributors, the contributors that really helped success in this experiment was top management supported it, even the CEO, right? So they wanted to see what was going to work best, right? So they supported hybrid work. They supported work in the office, whatever they were doing at that point. So the company also...
made its hybrid work days consistent across the team. Again, this is not a willy-nilly kind of thing. You come in when you want, come out when you want. There's gotta be some structure to it. And I think structure sets expectation for human beings, because that's what we like. We like structure, we like expectations, because we like to know when we're supposed to be in. So it gives some semblance of freedom. And thanks for, you know, treating us like adults half the time. So, you know, at the end of the day,
I've said it before, we go from remote back to return to office. We try to take gas engines and go directly to electric, right? We try to do all of these things and this knee jerk reaction. Why don't we try hybrid? Why don't we try hybrid and try to maybe walk it into remote or try hybrid and try to walk it into electronic vehicles, right? I mean, that to me,
As human beings, we just need to stop the knee-jerk bullshit.
Joel (22:17.144)
Yeah, I think, you when this, as this issue has unfolded, I've always thought that you're going to have companies that are full, full on office. You're going to have people that sort of hybrid will do the office three days a week at home, two days a week, and then you'll have your businesses that are full remote. And to me, what, what this is evolving to, if you're doing it right is all three. So based on what your employees want, you have an answer for that.
Chad (22:29.409)
Yeah.
Joel (22:42.688)
So if you have a 25 year old recent grad that wants to like engage with people, be in the office, then they can do that. If you, if you have people that, yeah, I want to go into work, but not every day, I want to have Friday to myself, or I want to have Monday to like recover from the weekend. They can do that. If you want to go live in Burlington, even though our offices in Boston, you can do that too. I think the most successful companies will have an answer for all three of those groups.
and I think that we're slowly unfolding and evolving to that reality, which I think, is great. And these data points support, all of those, all of those trends. I, I'm happy and divert diversity, inclusion, helping women, people with disabilities older, like everyone wins in this and the technology is there that you can do it and not lose and you'll make more money and be more productive. So I.
Chad (23:21.515)
Yeah. More experiments.
Chad (23:31.756)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (23:37.685)
Yeah, Well, if you take a look at it, if we do crack down on immigration and we don't have as many people coming back or coming to be able to drive work and actually support work in the US, because immigration has been our superpower, every single other country,
Joel (23:38.67)
I got nothing man.
Joel (23:46.722)
Yeah.
Chad (24:00.381)
and or group of countries, their inflation's higher. They haven't been able to snap back as fast. We were able to snap back incredibly fast. And one of the biggest contributors is immigration because we had people to do those jobs and get right back into this job. So if we start to push that back, we're going to have to have something that fills those roles, right? Not all of those roles are hybrid and or remote roles, but there's going to be there's going to be some movement.
of talent from here to there. And there's going to be a need to be able to look at some those hybrid roles more.
Joel (24:34.072)
You don't have to come to America. We'll employ you in whatever country you are is a powerful mass message. And it's something a lot of companies are going to have to come to grips with because yes, immigration will be a topic at least for the next two years. So, so get used to that. let's take a quick break. This is an abbreviated show cause Chad and I have been up most of the night, if not all night watching the election and getting drunk, hung over drinking too much coffee. So we will be right back after this message.
Chad (24:38.251)
Here I am.
Chad (24:42.87)
Yeah.
Chad (24:47.263)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (25:06.134)
All right, Chad, let's talk a little LinkedIn. They reported a 10 % increase in revenue for fiscal first quarter reaching $3.23 billion with growth across all business lines. Looking forward, LinkedIn anticipates a similar revenue growth rate in the next quarter. CEO Satya Nadella of Microsoft highlighted strong user growth in markets like India and Brazil.
Chad (25:09.12)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (25:34.048)
and introduced LinkedIn's AI powered hiring assistant that Emmy and I talked about last week. Chad, what are your thoughts about the money printing machine that they apparently have at LinkedIn?
Chad (25:46.571)
And by the way, I love me some Emmy. She did such a great job. I feel feel I feel so comfortable just not being on the show every now and again. You're going to have to take some time away so her and I can can spend some time, by the way. OK, so quick, quick quote from the actual article. Member growth continues to accelerate with markets like India and Brazil, both growing at double digits. That that's pretty amazing. Although there's got to be some more
Joel (25:49.23)
You
Joel (25:52.717)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (26:10.296)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (26:15.527)
long-term growth that that LinkedIn is looking at and they are they're looking at total addressable market expansion which means LinkedIn is rolling out a new coaching feature in LinkedIn learning that uses text and voice to enable users to practice skills such as delivering performance reviews having conversations and work-life balance right so so we've talked about this but the the most important thing about this is that we have the business revenue stream
And then we have the individual revenue stream. And LinkedIn makes a good amount of money on both sides. And we don't really have many platforms that are out there today. Take a look at Indeed. Indeed does not monetize the job seeker, right? LinkedIn monetizes the job seeker. I'm not a big fan of it, but when you start to actually create these types of features and or products and services,
I think it makes more sense, right? Just a resume, right? A resume writing thing. Big deal. Anybody can do that now with the chat GPT. But what about the coaching side of the house? I think for me, this is good for LinkedIn, at least from the standpoint of taking a long-term look. We see all these emerging markets, India, Brazil, growing double digits. And then we're also doubling down on something that we're doing well already. And we're increasing the TAM there. So good on LinkedIn.
Joel (27:17.624)
Mm-hmm.
Joel (27:39.394)
Yeah. You know, you and I talked pretty extensively a few years ago when they were, I don't know their, their monopoly plan, the monopoly plan to crush everything that's innovative around using, Hi Q obviously is a case that we talked quite a bit about. one of the, risks that we said was there is look, if, if, if LinkedIn crushes all innovation, all competition,
Chad (27:49.801)
yeah.
Chad (27:53.739)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Joel (28:09.538)
they're going to be a sewer of non-innovation because they're going to have the field to themselves. Fortunately for them, they have an easy button called OpenAI and Microsoft's relationship with that technology. And I think that you're seeing the AI, the hiring assistant, anecdotally, everyone that I've talked to and recruiting that uses it, likes it. I know we've been on the ATAP.
conversation where people are using it and liking it. And now they're taking that to another level. They're growing. they're growing into other countries. think India is a huge market. South America, think is going to blow up. Africa is next. So Africa is still there. you mentioned the learning piece, which is, think. Exciting, but ultimately I feel like in the bigger picture, LinkedIn feels.
like a social network that hasn't lost its shit. I don't feel like they've gone off the deep end with political stuff. they've, they've implemented a tick talky type, video product, which is pretty good. I'll click on a video before I know it. I've gone through like 50 videos and it's about like recruiting and marketing and it's content that is not what I get on, on tick tock. So I'm, I'm more engaged than ever with LinkedIn.
recruiters seem happier with LinkedIn than they have been in a while. So I, I think this is full steam ahead, for LinkedIn. I think indeed should be a little scared if they actually turn the spigot on job search and giving companies that, that power. yeah, we're going to continue to see profit tries it at LinkedIn. Things are good. and I don't see any reason why the train and the good times won't keep going.
Chad (29:59.435)
Yeah, so the learning side, upskilling, that's big right now. It's gonna continue to be big. again, I see them aligning on the upskilling side and there can be a couple of different things. You've got the enterprise license for your current employees or you have the individual license for somebody who just wants to do it themselves. But yeah, when it comes down to the TikTok side of the house, yeah, they're starting to...
Joel (30:02.904)
Mm-hmm.
Chad (30:26.879)
implement some of those things, which is great. I really would love to see them finally use the data that they have access to on the profiles to be able to understand, contextualize, and give me jobs that make a god—that don't make sense. That don't make sense. They send me—they send me crap all the time. So if they can utilize—
any one of these parsing matching types of systems that are out there, the text kernels of the worlds, the dax, the dachshunds of the worlds, or maybe even create a large language model within open AI, then great. But Jesus, man, you gotta do better there. You gotta do better there. Indeed's not doing better. So you gotta, and you've got all the tools to do it.
Joel (31:14.542)
And by the way, if they happen to slip in the occasional big-booted Latina in their video feed, I won't complain. I won't complain.
Chad (31:18.696)
Ha ha ha!
Chad (31:22.677)
Yeah.
Joel (31:26.402)
We'll be right back.
Joel (31:32.68)
All let's have a little Halloween back to the future on this one. During a Halloween themed all hands meeting, Google executives, including CEO Sundar Pichai in costume, discussed cost saving measures and head count efficiency. So a little awkward for a Halloween themed hands on meeting. They addressed reduced hiring.
Chad (31:37.249)
There it is. There it is.
Joel (31:56.92)
due to economic conditions and a focus on AI. Chad, this is a whole new level of ghosting. What are your thoughts on Google's all hands, all Halloween, all the time, serious meeting with employees?
Chad (32:12.872)
So this article comes from our friends over at HR grapevine. If you're not subscribed or what have you, it's one of the, one of the sources that Joel and I actually tap to be able to do this show. but yeah, Google CEO Sundar Pichai, he, he called on Google Googlers to quote unquote, strive to do more in 2025 and beyond as a part of, as a part of
the push for greater efficiency, which you said earlier, tell me that's not a thinly veiled threat, right? Then Brian Ong, VP of Google recruiting, spoke on changes to Google's hiring at a time when many tech employers are reallocating significant resources toward investment AI. His comment then, quote, there is a reality to it. We are hiring less than we did a couple of years ago, end quote. So that's interesting because
We've known and worked with people at Google over the past couple of decades. And it's all about resources for them. So when Google deemed their talent acquisition products, Google Hire and Google for Jobs API, were less of a revenue driver than Google Cloud, they reallocated resources and shut down the TA products. That's what happened, kids. So for years, for years,
There seems to have this constant reshuffling of talent and resources from product to product. So for me, Sundar's thinly veiled threat and Brian Ong's same as paraphrase, AI is here for your job and it's not safe. That to me is the velvet hammer. They're literally coming out and they're being nice and fluffy. saying, but you got to strive to do more. yeah. I don't know if I said or not, we have AI. It's the velvet hammer.
Google's Velvet Hammer.
Joel (34:10.136)
So the CEO wore a t-shirt that said error 404 costume not found. How dorky was that? And the CFO wore a re no, I don't, I don't. And the CFO wore a Reggie Miller, Indiana Pacers, a Jersey, which I thought was, kind of funny. but yeah, I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall, with the CEO, everyone, dressed up very, very awkward.
Chad (34:19.944)
You have that t-shirt, though, right?
Chad (34:30.443)
bad form.
Joel (34:39.714)
Look, techies are scared, man. I mean, these people aren't stupid. They hear the Amazon queue stuff. They hear the, the jassy stuff around how many, how much money in man hours they're saving with, with AI and coding and development. They hear the, they hear the quarterly earnings reports where they talk about 25 % of all new code at Google.
is generated by an AI. If I'm a techie that says your job is in jeopardy and they kind of sugarcoated it like, no, we like find new product projects. You may not need 10 people, maybe you need eight, but it's not going to stifle, innovation and opportunity. But look, these people aren't stupid. mean, they kind of see the writing on the wall and they're concerned about it and they're scared. People at Google live a pretty good life, right?
And they have for a long time. And once you start shuffling that deck and, and, know, the shuffle in the chairs on the Titanic, people get scared. And it came out in all places at an all hands meeting where the CEO was wearing an arrow error for a, for costume, not found t-shirt, like how, how Silicon Valley, if you love that show that's straight out of that, that fucking show. Yeah. It's good stuff. It's good stuff. Well, Chad, I'm
Chad (35:46.487)
Halloween. Yes.
Chad (35:57.793)
Jassy, again, the Iron Fist Sundar the Velvet Hammer.
Joel (36:03.054)
I don't have a good joke, Chad, but I'm gonna throw joke in since we're still on Halloween. What is a mummy's favorite kind of music?
Chad (36:07.146)
Okay.
Chad (36:14.271)
rap and roll? Rap?
Joel (36:16.194)
just rap. Yeah, rap, rap, rap. Rap and roll is not a thing, old white man. Enjoy Portugal, enjoy the waves. I'm gonna take a nap. We out.
Chad (36:22.233)
Okay, I thought it might be new.
Chad (36:28.213)
We out.
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